Seriously funny: An interview with legendary performer Sandra Bernhard

By Gregg Shapiro

Photo By Nick Spanos

With a performing career spanning five decades, there is no one else like Sandra Bernhard. From stand-up comedy to acting roles, both comedic and serious, in films and on TV to her musical performances, Bernhard is an artist of many talents. In addition to her much-discussed performance as Nurse Cecily in Apple TV+’s “Severance” and her upcoming role in the Timothée Chalamet movie “Marty Supreme,” Bernhard has once again taken to the stage with her new live show “Shapes & Forms,” with tour dates in various cities. Sandy was gracious enough to make time for an interview in the spring. [Sandra Bernhard performs on June 13 at the Vivarium in Milwaukee and on June 14 at Park West in Chicago.]

Gregg Shapiro: Sandy, I’ve had the pleasure of interviewing you a few times over the years, most recently in 2017, during your Sandra Monica Boulevard tour, in advance of your South Florida performance in Dania Beach. I noticed that South Florida isn’t on your current tour itinerary. Will you be adding SoFlo dates for your LGBTQ fans?

Sandra Bernhard: Sure, eventually. My agent books the shows. They come as they come. This is not like a huge, endless, proper tour. I might pop in there next year or at the end of this year. You just never know. But we’ll work on it, OK?

GS: Good! Living in South Florida, I’m concerned about the way people feel about this place and our horrible governor. I'm glad you're not making a political statement.

SB: No, not at all. There are so many places I haven't been back to in the past five years because I've been busy doing other things. I don't want to be on the road endlessly either.

It’s not where my head is at. I usually do three or four dates at a time, and then I’m back home. We’ll work on South Florida for you.

GS: Thank you! A lot has happened since we spoke in 2017, including Joe Biden’s presidency,the COVID-19 pandemic, and, worst of all, two non-consecutive terms held by the current President. How much, if any, of these subjects are included in your new “Shapes & Forms” show?

SB: I certainly address as much as I think is palatable about the present situation. But of course, I always try to bring it into some sort of more clever or funny way rather than just beating people over the head with the obvious things they can read in the news every day. You try to give them a little bit of simultaneous revelation and relief from what's happening. I think that's one of the things I'm good at.

GS: What is the significance of the show’s title, “Shapes & Forms?”

SB: It was the name of my mother's art studio when I was growing up. She was an abstract artist, and we had driven through New Mexico on our move out to Arizona when I was quite young. She made the

comment, “Oh, look at all these shapes and forms,” as she observed the mountains and the desert terrain.We always teased her about it. Thenshe ended up using the title to call

her studio Shapes and Forms.

GS: That's great! Do you have a lot of her pieces?

SB: I do! I have two of my favorites. I have more stuff in storage in LA, because I moved out of my house there, so I’ve got to get some stuff back. But I've got some of her sculptures, drawings, and paintings. I'm looking at two of them right now that I love.

GS: Have you made visual art as well?

SB: No. My daughter is a visual artist. It skipped a generation, and she is also very talented. I have different talents, the ones you are aware of. I'm not an artist in that way. I’m not a visual artist.

GS: Your busy performance career includes acting roles in movies and TV series, hosting a podcast, and even being a guest judge on “RuPaul’s Drag Race,” and you still find time to return to live performance with your stage shows such as “Shapes & Forms.” How important is it to you to maintain that profile?

SB: I love performing live. As long as I can do it, I will do it. As long as there's an audience that buys tickets to my shows, I’ll show up. I love it. I love writing. I love curating my music and working with my

band, The Sandyland Squad Band. It’s what I've been doing for decades now. When you work that hard at something that most people can't do, you never want to give it up.

GS: That’s true. I’ve always admired the way that you incorporate music into your live shows. Is there a chance you’d consider including songs by queer artists such as Lucy Dacus or Troye Sivan?

SB: It's truly not about that for me. I just like great songs. I really dip into the past. I wouldn't say no. They probably aren't necessarily my songs, but I'll check them out and I'll get back to you on that.

GS: Do you think you might consider recording another music album?

SB: For sure! We record my live shows, and there's a lot of stuff on Spotify, Pandora, and Apple Music;

things that I've done over the years. I've actually written and recorded some new music. It's just sort of in limbo right now. Maybe eventually we'll get it together and put out a little EP.

GS: That would be great. On your 1994 album “Excuses For Bad Behavior,” you made a Tracy

Chapman reference. What do you think of Tracy’s unexpected return to the limelight?

SB: What's more unexpected to me is that she didn't keep recording and putting music out all these years. I can't imagine why she wouldn't have. She's a major talent. I’m glad she's back, but I hope

that she can duplicate some of her original fabulosity.

GS: “The King of Comedy,” featuring your award winning breakthrough performance as Masha, was released more than 40 years ago. When you look back at the movie, what did that experience mean to you?

SB: Everything! It was a turning point in my career. It gave me the confidence to know that I was a good actress who could handle myself alongside the heavyweights like Robert De Niro and Martin Scorsese. It always reminds me that the more talented the people you work with, the better you are,

because water always rises or cream always rises, whatever the expression is. When you work with really great people, they encourage you to be as good as possible.

GS: I still get choked up when I think about your performance as nurse Judy in Ryan Murphy’s series “Pose.” Can you please say a few words about what attracted you to that role?

SB: Honestly, I didn't even know what the role was when I ran into Steven Canals and Our Lady J at the

airport. We were talking and I said, “If there's ever anything in the show for me, please reach out.” They just happened to be casting that role at that moment. When they ran it past Ryan Murphy, who was a fan of mine, he said, “Yeah, let's cast her.” I didn't audition for it, I didn't read it. They just sent it to me and I said, “Of course I'll do it. It's an incredible role. That's how that happened.

GS: Do you think that because you lived through that era, those early days of the AIDS crisis, that that helped you bring something to that role that maybe a younger artist wouldn't have been able to?

SB: For sure, I had a lot to draw on.It was easy to access those emotions and those memories.

Sadly, yes. But, yes, I think that did help.

GS: In recent years, you’ve given memorable performances in a variety of sitcoms and dramatic series, such as the aforementioned “Pose,” as well as “Survival of the Thickest,” “Severance,” “American Horror Story,” and “2 Broke Girls.” What appeals to you as a performer about these kinds of guest spots?

SB: As an actress, you always want to challenge yourself and have opportunities to work. That's really

what it's all about. Would I love to be a regular on a series? Actually, that’s what I'm working toward right now. That's where the money is, and that's where the continuity is. That's my goal and

has been for a while.

GS: It would be fantastic to see you as a recurring regular character. Youare the author

of three books: “Confessions of a Pretty Lady,” “Love, Love and Love,” and “May I Kiss

You on the Lips, Miss Sandra?” Do you think you might have another book in you, perhaps

a novel?

SB: I don't think so. I don't really think that's what I have time to focus on. There are so many incredible books out there; young writers, standby writers, and people that have written so much good work. I'm not gonna be like, “Oh yeah, maybe.” I think I put my writing into my live performing, and that's good enough for me.

Photo By Brett Erickson